neraulia ([info]neraulia) wrote,
@ 2008-12-09 18:14:00
Previous Entry  Add to memories!  Tell a Friend  Next Entry
Current music:Nine Inch Nails - Head Like a Hole | Powered by Last.fm
Entry tags:nin a day, nine inch nails

day 4, halo 2, song 1
Now we have arrived at Halo 2, BKA Pretty Hate Machine. Interestingly, in the credits for PHM, Trent thanks the author Clive Barker and Prince (among others) for ideas.

First track is "Head Like a Hole." We will be revisiting this track later via a single release with some remixes. This is obviously the non-remixed version. 

"HLAH" is one of the more direct NIN songs. Maybe that's why it got so much radio play, even though its message is subversive.  It also has a double chorus, ergo twice the catchiness, I guess. The lyrics are anti-authoritarian and rebellious. They point at a lack of faith in organized religion and bourgeois ideals. Reminds me of the expression "I'd rather be the hammer than the nail," except this is the reverse - Trent wants to be the nail that breaks the hammer. Hell, yeah.

This was the first NIN song I ever heard, back in high school. I thought the kids in my school who wore NIN t-shirts were weird, so I didn't buy the tape. *facepalm* File that one under lost opportunities....

I've been reading some of the articles and interviews from 1990, when NIN were touring for PHM. In one of them, Trent talks about how he learned to abuse the audience, and how he takes a song and arranges it, "rather than building up a groove and chanting over it." He also said that he had done the vocals for PHM in one take. It's pretty amazing how consistent his attitudes have been over the years, and how straightforward he has been about expressing them.

Reading those early interviews, I also realize that although I'm writing this series out of fandom and a wish to better understand NIN's music (not to mention perhaps undiagnosed OCD?), Trent might not approve if he read any of it. I'm overanalyzing, projecting my thoughts and feelings onto his songs and lyrics. But isn't that inevitable? Would it be better to nod and smile than at least try to understand? If it seems like I'm taking this too seriously, that's what I do....

Also interesting how in this video, Trent does wind up having control taken from him at the end. This later recurs in the video for "Closer" and is implied in "Happiness in Slavery" (song and video). Is it a nightmare become reality, or a wish fulfilled?


(12 comments) - (Post a new comment)


[info]sushis
2008-12-10 03:49 am UTC (link)
"Is it a nightmare become reality, or a wish fulfilled?"

YES! IT IS!

(Are you sure you don't want to cross post this? I know you mentioned it on [info]meta_reznor but if you also posted these there, I think that would be nice, too.)

Anyway, that non-specific "yes" gets back to what I tend to think of as a central thematic problem/attraction of NIN--the tension between hating abuses of power on the one hand, and being attracted to the experience of surrendering one's will on the other hand.

Now, the latter is never explicit, and the former (the hatred of abusive power) is always very forcefully stated, but, as you suggest, I think that the videos draw out the latent second meaning. Although this is decades past HLAH, I do think that YZ songs like "Vessel" bring the latent desire for surrender that you notice in the HLAH video into sharper relief.

Back to the article you linked to--it's interesting to note that Trent started out abusing the audience, and part of the reason he kept on doing it, was that he noticed that they loved it. Hmmm...It's something to think about, how maybe the psychology of hating the true abuse of power, but loving the sensation of being overpowered, may be at work both in the artist and the audience.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]neraulia
2008-12-10 02:42 pm UTC (link)
I want to have everything in one place, but I'll start posting them to [info]meta_reznor instead. Probably will be better for the non-NIN fans on my f-list anyway.

Good points re: tension between both aspects.

BTW I found it interesting that although the audience loved it, Trent said that it made him respect them less. Which opens another can of worms - when is it performance, and when is it something else? The answer to that is probably that it's both at once, as well.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]sushis
2008-12-10 03:26 pm UTC (link)
Oh, that's a good point about what Trent said about respecting the audience less. One can't always simply separate things out neatly into the bad abuse of power on the one hand and the good/fun performance of power on the other. One can bleed into the other.

I may enjoy being among the "motherfucking pigs" Trent is yelling at, assuming it's an act, reacting as though I were being berated benignly by someone who respects me but knows I'm into a weird game, when the fact is, he really does hate me/us, on some level. OTOH, is this possibility nonetheless part of the attraction in the first place? If it was obviously all an act, maybe it wouldn't be as interesting.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]neraulia
2008-12-10 03:43 pm UTC (link)
Exactly. It's messy.

Aside from what it does to the audience, who may be into that dynamic for one night - what does it do to the person who "performs" abuse almost every night for a year-long tour?

Are weird games completely benign? Do we become the games/parts we play? Does catharsis reinforce the original issue?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]sushis
2008-12-10 04:37 pm UTC (link)
"what does it do to the person who "performs" abuse almost every night for a year-long tour?"

That's a very good question!

It brings me to my response to this question: "Are weird games completely benign?": It depends absolutely upon the players. I don't think people who really enjoy such games are necessarily any worse off than those who do not, or that they have a problem that needs to be corrected. All human interaction is frought with power differentials, and being intrigued by the performance of power, even where it brings with it the danger of corrupting one side with hatred and the other with self-destruction, isn't necessarily worse than keeping everything quiet or hidden. Getting into the performance of power (either in the powerful or disempowered role) has potential rewards as well as risks.

On Trent's side of things (talking about Trent the audience-belittling performer now, not Trent-tied-up-in-HLAH-and-Closer-videos) my guess is that it's not entirely benign. I love Trent, but I think perhaps he gets angrier than situations necessarily warrant, and that he has a tendency to deal with anger in unhealthy ways. If he works out some of that excess anger on his fans...Well, now that I think about it, maybe it doesn't come from a healthy place, but perhaps it's actually a healthy way to deal with what nature has dealt his own psychology. Or perhaps also, not...

As for us "motherfucking pigs" (me and all the other fans who enjoy being berated by Trent)--again, I think it depends on each individual. One can get a charge out of it without feeling at all diminished by it. But, I suppose there are some people who really feel worthless, and seek out chances to have that feeling confirmed...but I have trouble imagining that those are the people who are into the dynamic. Or, if they are, maybe even then, it's a relatively positive way of dealing with a pre-existing negative. Or, like I said for Trent in his "demean the fans" role, for those people at least, it is possible that it's somewhat harmful, for some of them...I don't know.

I'm reasonably certain, though, that I'm not damaged by it

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]neraulia
2008-12-10 05:40 pm UTC (link)
Really enjoyed reading your reply as usual.

I never take the "pigs" thing personally, because Trent never addresses individual fans that way. Maybe it's in part his way of overcoming another power dynamic: being on a raised platform in front of an unruly mob is a risky thing. Being angry and intimidating is a way to take control (and of course, it's entertaining and holds people's attention). He's also talked about his muscular build being like "armor" on stage - maybe that's defense and the name calling is offense, though I'm oversimplifying for sure, and not taking into account songwriting vs. performance.

Part of how this whole issue of rehearsing anger came up for me is that I read a book called Anger by a Zen Buddhist monk named Thich Nhat Hanh. He's pretty popular in the genre. He kept citing some psychological research that showed that people who tried to get rid of their anger by yelling in a closed car, punching pillows, etc. didn't actually become less angry. Other Buddhist stuff I've read has included abstinence from violent movies and other media in an overall call for nonviolence. But part of the reality of this world is that it contains a lot of violence. I haven't figured out how to reconcile all of this for myself.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
TMI: I r a prevert
[info]sushis
2008-12-10 07:35 pm UTC (link)
"I never take the "pigs" thing personally,"

hmmmm...I've been trying to avoid pointing out the elephant tied up in the corner of the room, but I think I'll come out and say it, since it's hard to explain what I'm saying without it: I don't take it personally, intellectually speaking, nor do I take it personally, qua insult, emotionally speaking. However, I derive enormous perve value from masculine men who I'm attracted to behaving dominantly (toward me? That's not essential, but I think my brain is happy to make the connection, to bring me into the equation.) Thus, although I'm aware that Trent doesn't know that I exist, and therefor is neither insulting me personally nor feeding my perversions for my specific benefit, said perversions get fed nonetheless, by Trent. So, no, it's not personal, but on one level it functions as if it were. And, while I know my experience is not universal, I do suspect that it's perhaps slightly more common among NIN fans than in the general population.

So, getting back to Trent's side of things: I think what the monk you mention says is relevant in part, insomuch as Trent is simply expressing rage, and not participating in the exchange in any empathic sense. That is, if he's insulting the audience, plus feeling contempt for a large part of the audience's enjoyment at being insulted, then, yes, he's probably just getting angrier at everyone. OTOH, if he's enjoying the performance of dominance, but now doing it (at least in part) while enjoying the fans' enjoyment, rather than disdaining it and feeling contempt for them, the anger has been (at least in part) transformed from something potentially violent into something at once altruistic and pleasurable for himself.

Of course, it's in my interest to believe the latter, although I don't believe Trent has ever said anything to support the idea, so it's by no means an ironclad argument. On the side of my argument is the fact that Trent does appear (based on lyrics and videos) to understand "my" side of the "relationship."

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]neraulia
2008-12-10 09:28 pm UTC (link)
Performance of violence as altruism! Interesting concept.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]sushis
2008-12-10 09:38 pm UTC (link)
Well, more the performance of dominance than of violence, but, yes, inasmuch as he's not primarily that sort of pervert, but is indulging those who are of the complementary sort, ie, those of us who are the sort that he probably is (I know what I'm saying here, and I suspect you do, without my spelling it out, but if you're confused, it's because I haven't spelled it out, not because I don't know what I'm trying to say.)

Uh, yeah.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

[info]neraulia
2008-12-10 09:40 pm UTC (link)
LOL - I emailed you.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

[info]wihst3dimpnity
2008-12-11 04:40 am UTC (link)
OMG I MISSED THIS POST!
YES I'M EXCITED ABOUT READING IT, SO MUCH THAT I HAVE TO COMMENT HERE BEFORE I BEGIN TO READ!

EDIT:
Wow i loved reading you and sushis about the subject.

I just wanted to say:
Trent might not approve if he read any of it. I'm overanalyzing, projecting my thoughts and feelings onto his songs and lyrics. But isn't that inevitable? Would it be better to nod and smile than at least try to understand? If it seems like I'm taking this too seriously, that's what I do....

That's a good question. I mean i asked it myself a lot of times. How Trent would react to a comm like meta_reznor. And well, in ETS there was a lot of over analyzing posts there and he certainly read them. Did he enjoyed it? surely since it's always good for the ego. Does he likes to be THIS overanalyzed... Idk. I think he's more the type of guy who will read us and just think that we are a bunch of motherfucking nolifes. But i'm sure about one thing: projecting thoughts and feelings is what music is all about and 'fandom' is all about. I don't think it would be a big deal to discuss the songs with our own experiences. I think what could pissed him would be the fact that we think we can understand and know him through his songs. In a way we totally can cause those are shared feelings. In another way, he gives us the side of him he wanted to show.

Edited at 2008-12-11 05:03 am UTC

(Reply to this) (Thread)

[info]neraulia
2008-12-11 05:20 am UTC (link)
"In a way we totally can cause those are shared feelings. In another way, he gives us the side of him he wanted to show."

Yeah, very true.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(12 comments) - (Post a new comment)

Create an Account
Forgot your login or password?
Login w/ OpenID
English • Español • Deutsch • Русский…